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Origin of the name

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Meowy, before removing the reference to Georgian origin of the Kars name, please, find another non-Armenian source citing Armenian spelling (or Armenian meaning) of the word "Kars", to justify what appears to be original research without sources. Atabəy (talk) 01:02, 2 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Whoever inserted the claim that Kars is Armenian name, please, provide a verifiable source with meaning in translation. Otherwise, please, remove the false claim, as the name originated from Georgian kari (gate) per reference. Atabəy (talk) 15:50, 2 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
According to the following source: Placenames of the world By Adrian Room The name is subject to etymological speculation and "kari" is but one of them, the other being the Armenian word for bride.-- Ευπάτωρ Talk!! 16:08, 2 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Indeed. The source was verifiable. Or should it be "verifiable" by Atabəy? Sardur (talk) 16:09, 2 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Atabəy, I did NOT "remove the reference to Georgian origin of the Kars name"! Someone needs to hammer out once and for all what the "alternative names" section of Wikipedia articles should be. I do not think they are there to give supposed or speculative explanations of the origin of the place-name - they are there to list place-names that are alternatives or historical names of the current or official place-name. If I am right, the text currently within the article is not valid. The current solution also leaves the article wide open to propaganda "explanations" of the name origin, such as the laughable Turkish propaganda that the name is derived from a Turkish tribe. Meowy 16:42, 7 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Since no original meaning is provided in Armenian, I kept the Armenian spelling and Georgian spelling with addition that the word originates from Georgian "Kari" (the Gate) per reference. Atabəy (talk) 16:23, 14 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Read the source that was provided. In it you will find the Armenian meaning of the word. Thanks.-- Ευπάτωρ Talk!! 19:50, 14 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Well, why don't you provide the Armenian meaning here, in discussion. Moreover, the reference which Marshall moved down says that the name originates from Georgian and provides the meaning. So why move it down? What's the basis for claiming that reference to Armenian transliteration without meaning is more important than reference to Georgian name with meaning? Perhaps, we could move the debate to Wikipedia fringe theories to investigate why Armenian transliteration, which indeed means nothing and is not original, is pushed so much against the original? Atabəy (talk) 21:30, 28 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

1) The source clearly states that the name Kars originates form the Armenian word for bride. 2) We can leave the other source that suggests an alternative etymology elsewhere but not in the lead since the city was Armenian, not Georgian. Any other questions?-- Ευπάτωρ Talk!! 23:12, 28 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

You're claiming that one unverified source says the word originated from Armenian "bride", while removing the other, verifiable and linked source, which claims that it comes from Georgian "kari" - "gate". Now are we to believe you OR the source? Atabəy (talk) 00:18, 29 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Eupator, and why are you removing the source altogether? Atabəy (talk) 00:20, 29 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I'm getting sick and tired of this. What do you mean "unverified source", the Google Books link is right above! Here: Placenames of the world By Adrian Room. Do you see it now? Would you like it served with some caviar perhaps?-- Ευπάτωρ Talk!! 00:31, 29 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Eupator, please, follow WP:NPA and WP:AGF and be polite in your discussions. Also, the fact that you're getting sick and tired of WP:POV pushing is not the issue of other editors, in this regards, please, follow WP:OWN as well. Furthermore, the fact that you presented an Armenian name for the origin (lacking support) is not a sufficient justification for inserting an Armenian spelling of the city that is not in Armenia, and is located on the border of Turkey with both Georgia and Armenia. I do not understand your deliberate attempt to disassociate the city with Georgia and why did you remove the reference? Atabəy (talk) 00:47, 29 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Let's settle one aspect of this discussion. Based on the guidelines contained in Wikipedia:Naming conventions (geographic names), theories about the etymological origin of a placename should not be placed in the listing of alternative names in an article's lead section. Meowy 15:44, 1 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I have removed the POV tag. Partly because it is wrongly inserted - an entire article cannot be POV-tagged when all that is being argued about is a single point. Also, given that my opinion in the above post has not been countered, it seems there is no justification for having the POV tag in the article. The article already contains details about both theories on the origin of the name "Kars", and the arguments were about where in the article those theories should be stated. However, those arguments are settled if the advice in Wikipedia:Naming conventions (geographic names) is accepted (i.e. they they cannot be inserted in the listing of alternative names). Meowy 20:57, 9 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Again, since references say the name originates from Georgian "kari", there is no reason to keep only Armenian spelling in front - Georgian must be there also. If you want to remove it, fine remove Armenian as well. Atabəy (talk) 18:53, 31 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

This is disruption no matter how you slice it Atabek. The Georgian name is mentioned in the Etymology section of the article and constantly adding it in the lead reeks of POV pushing. Continue with these disruptive edits and I will report you to the Incidents/AA2 page and they will know how best to deal with it.--Marshal Bagramyan (talk) 02:14, 2 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Marshall, there is no need to threaten people but rather to discuss and come to consensus. There is no logical reason for listing Georgian in etymology section while showing Armenian in transliteration. Why is one upheld over the other, when references to both origins are provided. Atabəy (talk) 23:12, 9 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

You already have been overruled by three other editors and this is now becoming another familiar case of WP:ICANTHEARYOU. We have all come to agree with Meowy's compromise version; the rules he cites above are ones you apparently enjoy to ignor or prefer not to read. It preserves the Georgian text in the etymology section, since it's impossible to verify whether it comes from Armenian or Georgian. Even still, Kars has prominence for being a historically Armenian, not Georgian, city. This is the last warning.--Marshal Bagramyan (talk) 23:39, 9 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
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Closing the Border with Armenia

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Today someone wanted to remove a phrase about the closing of the border. While it is "only" a capital of a border province, the info is significant as the railways to Armenia from Kars were closed after the shut down of the border. But the info was present twice, once in the very lead and once under transport. So I moved the phrase down from the lead to transport and adapted the phrase a bit. Paradise Chronicle (talk) 05:20, 3 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Grand Mosque of Kars

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Do we have sources on the burning other than Turkish source. The current sources are only Turkish news media articles. Maidyouneed (talk) 01:31, 7 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Could you do us a favor and translate those Turkish articles into English using Google Translate? Dominator1071 (talk) 17:33, 7 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

It is not that we can not use google translate, its the source is Turkish. It is forbidden for the Turkish media, to report about the Armenian Genocide as we have multiple articles on Wikipedia which treat people being sentenced by Turkey for reporting or just speaking about it. The Turkish media are suspicious and not seen as reliable regarding the Armenians. A source from a Western (Europe/USA) University accepted by the majority of the academic world would be better to source this.Paradise Chronicle (talk) 19:55, 7 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Indeed it is not about the language. It is about the sources themselves. They are all only very recent Turkish news media articles newly describing a very old event. 3 out 5 are the same article, 1 out of 5 looks down (memurlar). All of the sources are republishing news from elsewhere, acting as news portal/aggregators; They are not the actual news sources themselves. The articles are describing a recent exhibition put on by the then Mosque Association president which isn't a reliable source in itself. That these are all only Turkish sources in regards to the Armenians around the time of the Armenian genocide also challenges their reliability. Maidyouneed (talk) 22:18, 7 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Armenian name

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Why is the Armenian name of the town included? These have been Turkish and Kurdish lands for a thousand years. Articles on Greek islands that were Turkish territory a hundred years ago are not allowing Turkish names to be included! Double standards seem to be at play. Someone explain it logically please. Dominator1071 (talk) 23:21, 15 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Please don't duplicate comments like this on multiple pages. But since you are doing this, I will copy my answer from Talk:Van, Turkey#Armenian name:
As a general rule, Ottoman names should be given for former parts of the Ottoman Empire now part of Greece, as for example in Chania, Crete, Lesbos, Giannitsa, etc.
If you could point out Greek places where the Ottoman place name is "not allowed to be included", please let me know.
Similarly, areas which have had important Armenian populations in the past should include the Armenian name. --Macrakis (talk) 13:34, 16 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

30 ekim dünya Karslılar günü

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Gazeteci Yazar, Mehmet Ali Arslan tarafından 2000 ve 2016 yıllarında duyurulan Dünya Karslılar günü 2024 yılında ilan edildi.ve ilk kutlaması 30 ekim Çarşamba günü Dünya genelinde kutlandı,Dünya Karslılar günü her sene 30 Ekim'de 78.180.134.79 (talk) 07:47, 10 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Evlerde ve Sosyal medyada kutlamalar yoğundu güzel bir etkinlik her sene 30 Ekim'de devam Blogyazari34 (talk) 08:00, 10 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Historical timeline of the city (approx)

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  • 6000 BCE Shulaveri–Shomu Culture
  • 4000 BCE Kura–Araxes Culture
  • 3000 BCE Trialeti–Vanadzor Culture
  • 2000 BCE Hurrians
  • 1500 BCE Hittite Empire
  • 1300 BCE Hayasa-Azzi
  • 1200 BCE Nairi
  • 900 BCE Urartu
  • 600 BCE Median Kingdom
  • 500 BCE Scythians
  • 400 BCE Achaemenid Empire
  • 350 BCE Kingdom of Iberia
  • 300 BCE Kingdom of Greater Armenia
  • 145 CE Parthian Empire
  • 300 CE Byzantine Empire & Sassanian Empire
  • 600 CE Principality of Iberia
  • 737 CE Umayyad & Abbasid Caliphate
  • 888 CE Bagratid Kingdom - Capital
  • 1045 CE Byzantine Empire
  • 1064 CE Seljuk Empire
  • 1206 CE Kingdom of Georgia
  • 1242 CE Ilkhanate
  • 1358 CE Jalayirid Sultanate
  • 1380 CE Qara Qoyunlu
  • 1387 CE Timurid Empire
  • 1390 CE Eretnids
  • 1400 CE Ak Qoyunlu
  • 1500 CE Safavid Iran
  • 1535 CE Ottoman Empire
  • 1878 CE Russian Empire - Oblast
  • 1917 CE First Armenian Republic — Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.9.115.168 (talk) 20:27, 4 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • 1918 CE Provisional National Government of the Southwestern Caucasus - Capital
  • 1920 CE Government of the Grand National Assembly
  • 1923 CE Turkey

79.185.124.185 (talk) 22:49, 3 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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