Talk:Grace note

Bagpipe music

This page says (for bagpipe music):

"All of these are played before the beat, while grace notes on other instruments tend to be played on the beat"

I think this is wrong. They are also played *on beat* for the bagpipe (except the toarluath) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 03:53, 6 April 2009 (talk) OC

Grace notes can be played in a variety of places and can even displace the notes they're attached to. It is a matter of taste and interpretation, so long as there is concensus as to what's being done among the musicians performing. This is true for any instrument; it is a stylistic choice. I don't know the exact science, but there is definitely literature on it. Greg Ravn (talk) 08:26, 5 December 2009 (UTC)

Within highland pipe music. If you study this use, especially studying the performances of players, you will find that there are actually two distinct uses of 'grace notes' in bagpipe music, those used as articulations, and those used as ornaments. Single ones placed before a note generally indicate 'articulation' and are placed on the beat. The complex groupings of multiple notes indicate embellishments or ornaments and only loosely indicate how they are played. Depending on the embellishment and player, they may come either before or after the sub-beat of the parent note.

There are two different ways of fingering the notes which crop up in grace note blocks, 'proper' fingerings and what I will call 'cut' fingerings. Proper fingerings are the same as those used to play notes 'usually', while 'cut' fingerings simply involve lifting any closed finger to sound a higher pitch. The exact pitch of a cut does not matter as, when well played, the duration is too short for the pitch to be heard.

When an embellishment is performed, some of the notes are played using 'proper' fingerings, while others are performed with cut fingerings and there is no indication of which is used within the notation. As far as I can tell, the notation is interpreted as an instruction like 'play a birl', and the player just knows how to perform one.

This is not just my opinion as "The highland bagpipe and its music" by roderic D cannon states "The term 'grace note' is a borrowing from classical music terminology, and is perhaps not quite appropriate, since the simplest possible grace note, as I have just described it, is not an ornamental flourish or 'grace' added to the music, but an essential part of the technique. An older and better name is 'cut'".

It is also worth noting that 'cuts' are also used on most, if not all, bagpipes and not just the highland pipe. This use of sounds as articulation has been adopted from pipes to many other instruments in many kinds of folk music, and I believe this use differs from the typical interpretation of them in classical music. Also see "The essential guide to Irish flute and tin whistle".

These 'cuts' essentially have constant duration regardless of tempo, as the effect where the mind perceives them as a articulation instead of a note only happens when they are very short. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A00:23C4:3426:7D00:872:F6E6:D829:2B8B (talk) 16:52, 31 January 2019 (UTC)

Metaphorical use

Not to be harsh, but does this section really need to exist? Ask me, using the term grace note this way is kind of like calling a party foul a Bush administration. Or, more accurately, like calling the Iraq war a comma. Greg Ravn (talk) 08:26, 5 December 2009 (UTC)

Additional citations

Why and where does this article need additional citations for verification? What references does it need and how should they be added? Hyacinth (talk) 22:47, 4 November 2011 (UTC)